Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

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bgaltd
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Thu Nov 15, 2018 9:02 pm

deadeyedick wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:42 pm
The purpose of the O ring is simply to stop the pellet sliding out the rear of the magazine. Its function is not to physically hold the pellet in place. I will though try what you suggest and push the pellets slightly further back into the drum where it can be gripped by the O ring. It is a botched fix, which userers of these rifles should not have to do. The problem is well known to AA and has been for some time. Their rolling development obviously does not include this problem being addressed.
i'll try asking the question again ........
bgaltd wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:15 am
is the multi mag even an Air Arms product ?

i thought it was an after market product made by someone else :shock: :shock: :shock:

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Roger5
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Thu Nov 15, 2018 9:28 pm

I would just like to say, I have had quite a few A/A S410 and S510 in both calibre over the years, and have never had or heard of this problem. If it was a Daystate, I would understand the problem :D having said that, the pellets do sometimes require seating, not really a problem though. Rog

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deadeyedick
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:47 pm

Yes the magazines I use are air arms as is the pellets.

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tonyc
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:57 pm

I've not been able to replicate this. Are we talking about the first pellet only? A practice I've carried forward from my use of Rowan mags: when hunting, I always load my mags with the last chamber (the one to be in line with the barrel) empty, slot the mag in and uncock the rifle, or pull a second cocking stroke if shooting immediately. I can imagine the possibility of a loose pellet in this position falling back and not rotating into the casing. My way there is no pellet to fall back and jam the rotation.

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deadeyedick
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:01 pm

When putting a magazine into the rifle I only fill it with 9 pellets. The chamber opposite the breech is left empty. I then just dry fire the empty chamber so the rifle is sitting uncocked. It must be noted It is not just the next pellet which slides forward between the drum and the clear front cover. If the muzzle is inclined in an upward direction it is all pellets. There is nothing to stop the pellets from sliding forward against this clear front cover. even when the rifle is put back to the horizontal position to load the next pellet, the pellets sometimes stay against the front. Sometimes if I tap the cover it moves the next pellet back into the drum just a little, and lets it be loaded without it stopping the rotation of the drum. More often than not though I have to drop the muzzle of the gun, below the horizontal, to be certain that the next pellet to be loaded has slide far enough back into the drum, so it does not jam the necessary rotation of the drum, which allows it to be pushed into the breech by the pellet probe. As I mentioned earlier, I communicated this problem to AA by e-mail. They replied, acknowledging this issue was known to them and that they were working on a solution.

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tonyc
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:17 pm

Sorry, can't help. I still can't replicate it. Both my clear covers are flat internally so nothing for loose pellets to catch on other than the loading hole. If one falls back it doesn't catch on the loading hole or fall through before the mag is fully advanced. If the cocking stroke, pellet probe and mag position were out of sync there might be a problem. As mine is now, if a pellet falls through it's caught by the pellet probe then loads without any problems. As I've said earlier, the pellets in one of my mags are loose enough to fall out with a gentle shake but the others (one AA and a printed mag) take a sharp tap to get the pellets out.

PS - Just been looking at the advance mechanism. Pulling the cocking lever back, but not fully, so the hammer isn't cocked, the mag doesn't rotate fully. On pushing the cocking lever forward the pellet probe and mage hole aren't aligned so the probe won't go home. Also the mag advance mechanism doesn't engage in the next slot so a lockup is possible. I still can't get a loose pellet to feature in this jam.

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deadeyedick
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Sat Nov 17, 2018 9:58 am

Thanks for your reply and suggestion. It is not a user problem it is a design failure to take into account that the rifle maybe used and loaded with the muzzle inclined upwards. As I mentioned before AA have acknowledged the problem I raised with them, so hopefully they will come up with magazine modification soon. Not holding my breath though as they have had plenty of time since these multi shot magazines have been on the go.

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TenMetrePeter
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Sun Nov 18, 2018 12:09 pm

Isn’t that what the O ring is for? Can’t you file the O ring channel to increase friction?

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tonyc
Posts: 376
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:38 pm

I didn't intend to imply this is a user problem - just trying to understand how and why you are getting it and I'm not.
Still none the wiser! :?

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deadeyedick
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Re: Air Arms Magazine Pellet Loading problem.

Sun Nov 18, 2018 7:52 pm

I do not know why some get the problem I raised and others don't. Perhaps the drums are manufactured on different machines and as such perhaps one machine has a different tolerance than another. Perhaps one CNC machine is producing these drums which produces a slight "interference" fit with the pellets than another machine. Only AA can answer that. The question still remains, if they know about the problem, which they have acknowledged through e-mail, then why has nothing been done about it. As a retired senior lecturer in engineering the solution to the problem is quite simple, there is nothing to retain the pellet into the drum. The back and front plates on the magazine simply stop the pellets from falling out. What is need as far as I am concerned, and probably the easiest and cheapest manufacturing fix is to relocate the O ring. Put it in the centre of the drum, and recess it deeper so that the pawl which rotates the drum does not touch the O ring. In order to further prevent the pawl from interfering with the O ring make the pawl wider so it cannot go into the recess which holds the O ring. An O ring placed in such a location would then be able to be placed between the head and skirt of the pellet, similar to that in the Wheirauch drum. The pellet in these magazines are retained without the need of a back and front plate. An O ring placed such would stop the pellets from sliding down and jamming between the drum and front cover when the muzzle is inclined upwards.

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